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Looking to see if anyone can guide me to additional information on Joannes van Sassen(us) and Anna Lopes (de Haro). I know they were married from Honesto Lopes de Haro's will, and found baptism records at St. Pieter in Leuven for them in 1570 and 1571 -- as well as this record which confuses everything.
agatha.arch.be/data/images/518/518_9000_000_11838_000/0_0506 (opent in een nieuw tabblad)
Any thoughts would be appreciated!!
Helene, think the Family Sassenius where bookprinters;
bib.kuleuven.be/bijzondere-collecties/erfgoed/aanwinsten (opent in een nieuw tabblad)
In your link;
Sassenius M. Joannes et Anna Lups ( not Lopes???)
14 children!
And some of the children with wife and children!
what does not make sense to me is how their first child was listed as born in 1572, and joannus was born in 1570, and anna lupi/lopes was born in 1571. Anna's sister Barbara married into the Elsevier family. And I know Honesto Lopes (de Haro) was Anna's father (from his will) - and he was born about 1540. So the dates don't match at all. Joannus's father was also Joannus, and I believe his mother was also Anna, so I am wondering if the two were combined mistakenly in the index?
I tried looking at the kuleuven records, and although I tried to set up a guest online account I could not access them. Thanks for the information though.
I understand your confusion. It appears as that Joannes the elder and Joannes the younger might have been mixed up. No clue which is correct.
There is a Wikipedia page for Servaas Sassenus (father or grandfather of this Johannes Sassenus). He and his descendants were the official printers of the University of Leuven for a century.
fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Servais_Sassenus (opent in een nieuw tabblad)
A legal file for the 'Raad van Brabant' (Council of Brabant) concerning a son, apparently following the death of Anna Lopes.
"Margriet van Putte, widow of Filips Sassenus from Leuven c. children and heirs of Anna Sassenus, Anna Lopes, widow of master Jan Sassenus the Younger, in her own name and for Joos van Neten. Hereditary annuity on the house called 'Brussele' in Leuven. 1648-1649."
agatha.arch.be/data/ead/BE-A0541_005608_808097#I56088080979849 (opent in een nieuw tabblad)
In the Leuven 'Schepenbank' (Court of Aldermen) deeds and accounts, found only one deed relating to his brother or uncle Andreas.
"Andries Sassenus aged 60 years' in 1603
schepenbankregisters.leuven.be/in/act/SAL7495_V42.3-R43.1 (opent in een nieuw tabblad)
At first glance the link you posted appears to be with the correct information.
agatha.arch.be/data/images/518/518_9000_000_11819_000/0_0076_r (opent in een nieuw tabblad)
What is your source for the "found baptism records at St. Pieter in Leuven for them in 1570 and 1571" ?
There is something going on here I can't explain. The baptismal record of Joannes dated 23/09/1570 that you provided is attributed in the INDEX as the child of Johannes / Andreas van Sassen, married to Catharina de Graef.
agatha.arch.be/data/images/518/518_9000_000_11838_000/0_0722 (opent in een nieuw tabblad)
In the BAPTISM ENTRY, I only see the name of the child, father, and the baptismal witnesses (Joannes filius Johannis van Sassen). I don't see the mother's name.
agatha.arch.be/data/images/518/518_9000_000_11819_000/0_0052_r (opent in een nieuw tabblad)
Can I then therefore conclude that the INDEX is not just an index, but also an interpretation? So it's good to remain critical of what's written here.
Why this Joannes is attributed to another couple by the index's compiler is unclear to me.
Coming back to your original question and looking at the baptismal records of Joannes Sassen and Anna Lups, this is definitely a Joannes Sassen married to an Anna. This Joannes and Anna must have been born before or around 1550.
agatha.arch.be/data/images/518/518_9000_000_11820_000/0_0028_r (opent in een nieuw tabblad)
The record I sent at 4:43 PM corroborates this. This is the only Joannes Sassen x Anna record that baptizes a son named Philippus (Filips).
Margriet van Putte, widow of Filips Sassenus from Leuven c. children and heirs of Anna Sassenus, Anna Lopes, widow of master Jan Sassenus the Younger, in her own name and for Joos van Neten. Hereditary annuity on the house called 'Brussele' in Leuven. 1648-1649.
With this information it seems to me that these 2 are indeed the Joannes Sassen and Anna Lopes you are looking for, and must therefore have been born long before 1570/1571.
Note: If Anna Lopes did indeed die shortly before 1648, she would have lived to a very old age.
Several genealogies online assume a different scenario.
Unlike the index, they mention the existence of two couples: Johannes Sassen(us) married to an Anna:
Johannes (born <1540) x Anna Pelsens
Johannes (born 1570) x Anna Lopes de Haro
odis.be/hercules/toonPERS.php?id=139220 (opent in een nieuw tabblad)
gw.geneanet.org/petercrombecq?lang=nl&pz=ludovicus&nz=crombecq&p=joannes&n=sassenus&oc=6 (opent in een nieuw tabblad)
I wasn't familiar with the first one, ODIS, but it does cite sources and appears as reliable.
thank you for helping me think about this. The other information I am using is this notary document fron Leiden in which Anna Lopes is listed as a child of Honesto Lopes de Haro and is indicated as married to Jan Sassen. interestingly Anna is not listed on the index as a child of Honesto, but is clearly an important family player (grandma did not disinherit her). Honesto's age in the genealogical cites has to be incorrect if the first child Ludovicus is correct.
agatha.arch.be/data/images/518/518_9000_000_11838_000/0_0396 (opent in een nieuw tabblad)
Minuutakten van notaris Ewout Hendricxz. Craen, 1616 II.
Soort registratie: Notariële akten(Akte)datum: 1616Plaats: LeidenGemeente: Leiden
Bijzonderheden:
Inventarisnummer 128 van archiefnummer 0506 in Archieven
Geregistreerde
Honesto Lopes de Haro
Paginaweergave
Bronvermelding
Minuutakten van notaris Ewout Hendricxz. Craen, 1616 II., archiefnummer 0506, Notarissen ter standplaats Leiden (Oud Notarieel Archief), inventarisnummer 128, blad 001
Periode: 1616
Invertory of the estate of the late Honesto Lopes de Haro en Maeijken van der Donc. For me, the deed is quite difficult to read, but I do recognize the names of Barbera Lopes de Haro and Mathijs Elsevier.
Thank you - I have found that document, and am right now working on trying to decifer what I can. And trying to carefully use AI to help (and getting quite a kick out of some of it's interpretations - for example I a pretty sure a crying child and a haystack are not listed under possessions. ) Thanks again!!!
Dorethé, toch wel hoor!
Barbera Honesto Lopes dochter van de effe ????????? Mathijs Elsevier ????
Cornelis, er staat: Barbera Honesto Lopes dochter van d' ... (eersame?) overledene, en Mathijs Elsevier boucvercoper haer man
Dat kan ik nog wel ontcijferen. Het kost mij teveel tijd om de rest letter voor letter te ontcijferen om te zien of er sprake is van andere erfgenamen en of die met name genoemd worden.
(algemene info over Mathijs: nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthijs_Elsevier (opent in een nieuw tabblad))
Another snippet of information, but since information is scarce, I'll post it anyway.
This book mentions the existence of a last will by Honesto Lopes.
In this will four children are mentioned.
Honesto Lopes de Haro married Marie Van der Donc, this marriage resulted in 4 children:
1. JACQUES, né in Louvain.
2. PIERRE LOPES, né in Louvain, who married in Leyden on January 10, 1585:
Abigaël Du Gerdyn, née in London, daughter of Antoine Du Gerdyn (de Tournai), and Déline du Chameau.
3. BARBERA LOPES , née in Louvain , who married in Leyden, 1591, Mathieu Elsevier,
né in Antwerp in 1564.
4. ANNE LOPES, née in Louvain, who married Jean Van Sassen, living in Brabant.
(This testament is also signed by Louis 1st).
[...]
Book:
RECHERCHES HISTORIQUES , GÉNÉALOGIQUES AND BIBLIOGRAPHIQUES SUR LES ELSEVIER
Author: A. De Reume, Brussels 1847
page 77
As it was customary in wills for children to be named in order of age. We could conclude from this that Anna Lopes was born after Barbara (8 February 1668).
Correction: after Barbara (8 February 1568).
Noting that children are typically named in order of age is very helpful information. this will help as I try to make sense of the information on Anne and Jean (jan/joannes) van Sassen and their children. If she was born after Barbara (1568) that makes the 1571 date on the baptism i found is accurate and the index of baptisms listing the first child of Joannes Sasson and Anna Lupi as occuring in 1572 suspect/does not make any sense. Since Joannes' father was also Joannes, and his mother an Anna, I wonder if/where they got mixed up?
In addition, I have found the will which held good information for me.
This is so interesting, and so much fun to try to make sense of. Barbara is my 10th great grandmother, but Anna, her sister, is interesting because My 12th great grandmother Catherine van den Berg (wife of Pieter Lopes de Haro) dis-inherted Barbara's and Anna's father Honesto for political differences yet, apparently did not disinherit Anna, and Honesto's will makes mention of that.
It seems rare, and I feel lucky, to be finding such interesting information about family dynamics. Adds so much more depth than just putting names on a tree. Thanks again to everyone who is helping.
(PS - if anyone finds anything on Catharina van den Berghe, wife of Pieter Lopes de Haro, would love to learn about it)
Enjoy the hunt and once again thanks to all for your help!!!!
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